Overrun of right margin

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Overrun of right margin

Andrew Bernard
I have some fairly dense scoring, but not immensely packed. Using A4 landscape, I find one page - only one - keeps running over the right margin. I have not see that before and I am not sure how to construct an MWE, and the score is too large to post.

What conditions would cause this behaviour? I don't know what to look for or what I am doing wrong, just business as usual as far as the engraving is concerned I would have thought.

Using 2.19.82.

I was unable so far to find any discussion of this in the archives. Maybe my search terms are incorrect, or is this very unusual?

Andrew



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Re: Overrun of right margin

Andrew Bernard
More info:

I am using this:

    \override NonMusicalPaperColumn.line-break-permission = ##f
    \override NonMusicalPaperColumn.page-break-permission = ##f

Which seems to be the cause.

This may yet again come down just to my ignorance. I have used the above construct to stop pages breaking unless I explicitly ask for it. Is this entirely wrong in terms of how to control that?

I readliy confess I do not really know what a non musical paper column is.

Andrew

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Re: Overrun of right margin

Jean Bréfort
In reply to this post by Andrew Bernard
Looks like a rythm error. Somewhere a duration is wrong and then notes
go through the bars. In that case lilypond does not know where the
break should be inserted.

Hope this helps,
Jean

Le samedi 19 janvier 2019 à 19:39 +1100, Andrew Bernard a écrit :

> I have some fairly dense scoring, but not immensely packed. Using A4
> landscape, I find one page - only one - keeps running over the right
> margin. I have not see that before and I am not sure how to construct
> an MWE, and the score is too large to post.
>
> What conditions would cause this behaviour? I don't know what to look
> for or what I am doing wrong, just business as usual as far as the
> engraving is concerned I would have thought.
>
> Using 2.19.82.
>
> I was unable so far to find any discussion of this in the archives.
> Maybe my search terms are incorrect, or is this very unusual?
>
> Andrew
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> lilypond-user mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user


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Re: Overrun of right margin

Andrew Bernard
Hi Jean,

Thank you. This is difficult New Complexity School music and the rhythms are hugely complicated, and with rapid metric modulation all over I sometimes have to leave out barchecks to get everything going (which is bad practice).

So I am fairly certain you are right. I had not thought of that. Makes sense.

Sometimes I wish I could just get to set nice Marching Band music instead. {No disrespect to Marching Bands!]

Andrew


On Sat, 19 Jan 2019 at 19:52, Jean Bréfort <[hidden email]> wrote:
Looks like a rythm error. Somewhere a duration is wrong and then notes
go through the bars. In that case lilypond does not know where the
break should be inserted.


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Re: Overrun of right margin

Karlin High
On Sat, Jan 19, 2019 at 3:15 AM Andrew Bernard <[hidden email]> wrote:
Sometimes I wish I could just get to set nice Marching Band music instead. {No disrespect to Marching Bands!]

Past posts from Anthony "Wols" Youngman say that marching band music has its own difficulties.
--
Karlin High
Missouri, USA

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Re: Overrun of right margin

Andrew Bernard
Aye, true enough indeed!

Nothing is simple in music.

Andrew


On Sun, 20 Jan 2019 at 04:31, Karlin High <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Sat, Jan 19, 2019 at 3:15 AM Andrew Bernard <[hidden email]> wrote:
Sometimes I wish I could just get to set nice Marching Band music instead. {No disrespect to Marching Bands!]

Past posts from Anthony "Wols" Youngman say that marching band music has its own difficulties.


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Re: Overrun of right margin

Andrew Bernard
In reply to this post by Jean Bréfort
Problem solved after much deconstruction.

I am setting a string quartet. In this section almost every note has a glissando, and some become to small to see. So I set this:

        \override Glissando #'minimum-length = #5
        \override Glissando #'springs-and-rods = #ly:spanner::set-spacing-rods

This works fine to give the minimum length of the glissandi. It turns out that this was forcing the score over the edge of the paper, not a rhythmic error. Adjusting that solves the problem. It's only when there are a large number of glissandi in the line that it occurs. I report this here in case it may help future archive searchers.

I am also tempted to this this may be a lilypond bug. Why does lilypond not break at a valid barline break in this sort of case? It seems the glissandi are interfering with page breaking. I am not sure.

Andrew



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Re: Overrun of right margin

Aaron Hill
On 2019-01-19 4:56 pm, Andrew Bernard wrote:

> Problem solved after much deconstruction.
>
> I am setting a string quartet. In this section almost every note has a
> glissando, and some become to small to see. So I set this:
>
>         \override Glissando #'minimum-length = #5
>         \override Glissando #'springs-and-rods =
> #ly:spanner::set-spacing-rods
>
> This works fine to give the minimum length of the glissandi. It turns
> out
> that this was forcing the score over the edge of the paper, not a
> rhythmic
> error. Adjusting that solves the problem. It's only when there are a
> large
> number of glissandi in the line that it occurs. I report this here in
> case
> it may help future archive searchers.

This is probably because glissandi are unbreakable by default.  If you
have one overlapping a bar line, then LilyPond cannot break there.

Consider the following:

%%%%
\version "2.19.82"
{
   \override Glissando.minimum-length = #5
   \override Glissando.springs-and-rods = #ly:spanner::set-spacing-rods
   \override Glissando.breakable = ##t
   \repeat unfold 32 { f'8\glissando e''8\glissando } f'1
}
%%%%

If you omit setting 'breakable to true, you'll see the result extends
all on one line.

-- Aaron Hill

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Re: Overrun of right margin

Trevor Bača-2
Hi Andrew, hi Aaron,

Yep (also for future archive searchers) I can confirm that the right margin overrun results from the Lily default that glissando aren't breakable, as Aaron identifies.

It should be enough to include just ...

   \override Score.Glissando.breakable = ##t

... to prevent this one particular instance of right margin overrun.

There are, of course, other conditions that can also cause right margin overrun. Jean Bréfort pointed to barline-crossing durations earlier in this thread, which can also cause right margin overrun. If you *want* barline-crossing durations (complexism or music before 1600) then you need to remove Lily's Forbid_line_break_engraver from every voice context in which barline-crossing durations occur. Something like ...

    \context {
        \Voice
        \remove Forbid_line_break_engraver
    }

... does the trick for all voices in your score.

Andrew, if you're engraving a lot of complexist music, I suggest removing the Forbid_line_break_engraver as a matter of course.


Trevor.

On Sat, Jan 19, 2019 at 7:13 PM Aaron Hill <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 2019-01-19 4:56 pm, Andrew Bernard wrote:
> Problem solved after much deconstruction.
>
> I am setting a string quartet. In this section almost every note has a
> glissando, and some become to small to see. So I set this:
>
>         \override Glissando #'minimum-length = #5
>         \override Glissando #'springs-and-rods =
> #ly:spanner::set-spacing-rods
>
> This works fine to give the minimum length of the glissandi. It turns
> out
> that this was forcing the score over the edge of the paper, not a
> rhythmic
> error. Adjusting that solves the problem. It's only when there are a
> large
> number of glissandi in the line that it occurs. I report this here in
> case
> it may help future archive searchers.

This is probably because glissandi are unbreakable by default.  If you
have one overlapping a bar line, then LilyPond cannot break there.

Consider the following:

%%%%
\version "2.19.82"
{
   \override Glissando.minimum-length = #5
   \override Glissando.springs-and-rods = #ly:spanner::set-spacing-rods
   \override Glissando.breakable = ##t
   \repeat unfold 32 { f'8\glissando e''8\glissando } f'1
}
%%%%

If you omit setting 'breakable to true, you'll see the result extends
all on one line.

-- Aaron Hill

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