NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

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NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

Federico Bruni-2
Hi all

While translating, I think I caught an error in the doc:

http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/the-offset-command

"""
The following example displaces the ‘broken’ OttavaBracket object
through its staff-padding property. Since the property takes a number,
offsets is provided with a list of numbers to account for the two
segments created by the line break. The slur piece on the first line is
effectively untouched since 0 is added to its default value. The
segment on the second line is raised two staff-spaces from its default
height. The default height happens to be 2, though it is not necesssary
to know this.

    {
      \offset staff-padding #'(0 3) Staff.OttavaBracket
      \ottava #1
      c'''2 c'''
      \break
      c'''2 c'''
    }

"""


- 1st problem: All the text from "The slur piece on the first line" do
not refer to the OttavBracket example, which is what is supposed to be
discussed in that paragraph, but to the example after that (the example
which mimics the effect of the \shape command).

- 2nd problem (maybe): I'm not even sure that the "slur on the second
line is raised two staff-spaces from its default height". Isn't 1.5 for
the endpoints? Here's the example:

{
  c'4-\offset control-points #'(
               ((0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 1))
               ((0.5 . 1.5) (1 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . -1.5))
              ) ( f'4 g' c''
  \break
  d'4 c'' f' c')
}





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Re: NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

David Nalesnik
Hi Federico,

On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:11 AM, Federico Bruni <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi all
>
> While translating, I think I caught an error in the doc:
>
> http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/the-offset-command
>
> """
> The following example displaces the ‘broken’ OttavaBracket object through
> its staff-padding property. Since the property takes a number, offsets is
> provided with a list of numbers to account for the two segments created by
> the line break. The slur piece on the first line is effectively untouched
> since 0 is added to its default value. The segment on the second line is
> raised two staff-spaces from its default height. The default height happens
> to be 2, though it is not necesssary to know this.
>
>    {
>      \offset staff-padding #'(0 3) Staff.OttavaBracket
>      \ottava #1
>      c'''2 c'''
>      \break
>      c'''2 c'''
>    }
>
> """
>
>
> - 1st problem: All the text from "The slur piece on the first line" do not
> refer to the OttavBracket example, which is what is supposed to be discussed
> in that paragraph, but to the example after that (the example which mimics
> the effect of the \shape command).

No, the paragraph actually does refer to the OttavaBracket example.
The problem is a simple typo: "the slur piece" ought to read "the
bracket piece" or "the ottava bracket piece".  (Do you want to change
this, or should I?)

>
> - 2nd problem (maybe): I'm not even sure that the "slur on the second line
> is raised two staff-spaces from its default height". Isn't 1.5 for the
> endpoints? Here's the example:
>
> {
>  c'4-\offset control-points #'(
>               ((0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 1))
>               ((0.5 . 1.5) (1 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . -1.5))
>              ) ( f'4 g' c''
>  \break
>  d'4 c'' f' c')
> }
>

Again, this is remedied by fixing the typo.  The default value of
OttavaBracket.staff-padding is 2.0.  (An issue could be raised with my
referring to a setting which could be changed at some point making the
reference inaccurate, but that's another issue!)

Best,
David

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Re: NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

Federico Bruni-2


Il giorno mer 7 giu 2017 alle 15:24, David Nalesnik
<[hidden email]> ha scritto:

> Hi Federico,
>
> On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:11 AM, Federico Bruni <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>>  Hi all
>>
>>  While translating, I think I caught an error in the doc:
>>
>>  
>> http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/the-offset-command
>>
>>  """
>>  The following example displaces the ‘broken’ OttavaBracket
>> object through
>>  its staff-padding property. Since the property takes a number,
>> offsets is
>>  provided with a list of numbers to account for the two segments
>> created by
>>  the line break. The slur piece on the first line is effectively
>> untouched
>>  since 0 is added to its default value. The segment on the second
>> line is
>>  raised two staff-spaces from its default height. The default height
>> happens
>>  to be 2, though it is not __necesssary__ to know this.
>>
>>


another typo: "necesssary"


>>     {
>>       \offset staff-padding #'(0 3) Staff.OttavaBracket
>>       \ottava #1
>>       c'''2 c'''
>>       \break
>>       c'''2 c'''
>>     }
>>
>>  """
>>
>>
>>  - 1st problem: All the text from "The slur piece on the first line"
>> do not
>>  refer to the OttavBracket example, which is what is supposed to be
>> discussed
>>  in that paragraph, but to the example after that (the example which
>> mimics
>>  the effect of the \shape command).
>
> No, the paragraph actually does refer to the OttavaBracket example.
> The problem is a simple typo: "the slur piece" ought to read "the
> bracket piece" or "the ottava bracket piece".  (Do you want to change
> this, or should I?)
>

Ok, it makes sense now.
Please take care of the change. I'm busy with updating the italian
translation...

>>
>>  - 2nd problem (maybe): I'm not even sure that the "slur on the
>> second line
>>  is raised two staff-spaces from its default height". Isn't 1.5 for
>> the
>>  endpoints? Here's the example:
>>
>>  {
>>   c'4-\offset control-points #'(
>>                ((0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 1))
>>                ((0.5 . 1.5) (1 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . -1.5))
>>               ) ( f'4 g' c''
>>   \break
>>   d'4 c'' f' c')
>>  }
>>
>
> Again, this is remedied by fixing the typo.  The default value of
> OttavaBracket.staff-padding is 2.0.  (An issue could be raised with my
> referring to a setting which could be changed at some point making the
> reference inaccurate, but that's another issue!)
>
>

Ok, but I thought that in the OttavaBracket example the segment in the
second line was raised by 3 (not 2) staff spaces.








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Re: NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

David Nalesnik
On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:48 AM, Federico Bruni <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> Il giorno mer 7 giu 2017 alle 15:24, David Nalesnik
> <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>>
>> Hi Federico,
>>
>> On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:11 AM, Federico Bruni <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>  Hi all
>>>
>>>  While translating, I think I caught an error in the doc:
>>>
>>>  http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/notation/the-offset-command
>>>
>>>  """
>>>  The following example displaces the ‘broken’ OttavaBracket object
>>> through
>>>  its staff-padding property. Since the property takes a number, offsets
>>> is
>>>  provided with a list of numbers to account for the two segments created
>>> by
>>>  the line break. The slur piece on the first line is effectively
>>> untouched
>>>  since 0 is added to its default value. The segment on the second line is
>>>  raised two staff-spaces from its default height. The default height
>>> happens
>>>  to be 2, though it is not __necesssary__ to know this.
>>>
>>>
>
>
> another typo: "necesssary"
>

Thanks!

>
>>>     {
>>>       \offset staff-padding #'(0 3) Staff.OttavaBracket
>>>       \ottava #1
>>>       c'''2 c'''
>>>       \break
>>>       c'''2 c'''
>>>     }
>>>
>>>  """
>>>
>>>
>>>  - 1st problem: All the text from "The slur piece on the first line" do
>>> not
>>>  refer to the OttavBracket example, which is what is supposed to be
>>> discussed
>>>  in that paragraph, but to the example after that (the example which
>>> mimics
>>>  the effect of the \shape command).
>>
>>
>> No, the paragraph actually does refer to the OttavaBracket example.
>> The problem is a simple typo: "the slur piece" ought to read "the
>> bracket piece" or "the ottava bracket piece".  (Do you want to change
>> this, or should I?)
>>
>
> Ok, it makes sense now.
> Please take care of the change. I'm busy with updating the italian
> translation...
>

Will do.

>>>
>>>  - 2nd problem (maybe): I'm not even sure that the "slur on the second
>>> line
>>>  is raised two staff-spaces from its default height". Isn't 1.5 for the
>>>  endpoints? Here's the example:
>>>
>>>  {
>>>   c'4-\offset control-points #'(
>>>                ((0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . 1))
>>>                ((0.5 . 1.5) (1 . 0) (0 . 0) (0 . -1.5))
>>>               ) ( f'4 g' c''
>>>   \break
>>>   d'4 c'' f' c')
>>>  }
>>>
>>
>> Again, this is remedied by fixing the typo.  The default value of
>> OttavaBracket.staff-padding is 2.0.  (An issue could be raised with my
>> referring to a setting which could be changed at some point making the
>> reference inaccurate, but that's another issue!)
>>
>>
>
> Ok, but I thought that in the OttavaBracket example the segment in the
> second line was raised by 3 (not 2) staff spaces.
>
>

Ah, OK -- that too!!  (Maybe I ought to make this clearer in the
explanation: the default value is 2.0, so the effect of the offset
command would to be raise the bracket 2 + 3 = 5 staff spaces.)

-David

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Re: NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

Federico Bruni-2
Il giorno mer 7 giu 2017 alle 15:57, David Nalesnik
<[hidden email]> ha scritto:
> Ah, OK -- that too!! (Maybe I ought to make this clearer in the
> explanation: the default value is 2.0, so the effect of the offset
> command would to be raise the bracket 2 + 3 = 5 staff spaces.)

Actually, this is clear in the doc. In my mind it was +3 _from the
default_ (2).


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Re: NR 5.3.6 The \offset command: confusion in describing the examples

David Nalesnik
On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 9:00 AM, Federico Bruni <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Il giorno mer 7 giu 2017 alle 15:57, David Nalesnik
> <[hidden email]> ha scritto:
>>
>> Ah, OK -- that too!! (Maybe I ought to make this clearer in the
>> explanation: the default value is 2.0, so the effect of the offset command
>> would to be raise the bracket 2 + 3 = 5 staff spaces.)
>
>
> Actually, this is clear in the doc. In my mind it was +3 _from the default_
> (2).

OK, I left this alone.

See https://sourceforge.net/p/testlilyissues/issues/5141/ for my fixes.

Thanks for pointing these problems out!

David

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